Arrrrrgh...

The more I learn about wolves, the more

A. I realize how much of a commitment and how difficult it would be

and

B. The more I dream about it ^_^


If I may ask a related question here please...

I know some dogs can become overly dominant if allowed to mate you. It seems that dominance is an issue already with just having a wolf in your life. Is there a high risk of a wolf becoming over-dom if allowed to mate you?
Would that make a female easier to have a relationship with?

Thanks to everyone who responded in short order to my question. All of your advice is really helping me piece together the puzzle. :clapping:

Most of what I've read from this post definitely reflects what I've read from other website such as the links Dirty fox, and shylark graciously added and the other website I've referred to before: The Wolf Dunn (type into Google, 1st link).

Here's my attempt to summarize the posted info (please let me know if something needs to be corrected / updated)


Owning a wolf hybrid will require:

- Lots of attention and training time from an early age to prevent extraneous aggression towards daily occurrences such as other dogs, people, leashed walks, cats, etc. - (dirtyfox, kneelsfordogs, benluv74, Itzwolf, offtopic)

- Also, the training needs to encompass and ensure the fact that the owner is the 'alpha' / dominant being - (dirtyfox, Itzwolf, kneelsfordogs)

- Since wolves are definitely pack animals the owner needs to be able to devote plenty of time and attention which will in turn discourage 'boredom destruction' - (dirtyfox, Wirehair, Itzwolf, benluv74)

- Wolf hybrids will need space to roam since that's what their wild counter-parts do constantly so invest in a decent sized yard with more security measures than your average dog requires: fence buried underground, height of fence at least 10ft with fence curled back at the top (wolves are excellent jumpers / climbers), don't let the hybrid enter any part of the yard that can't be destroyed, etc. - (wirehair, Itzwolf, benluv74)

- Be prepared for an expensive endeavor for above and beyond food and the general expenses of owning an above and beyond dog. - (Itzwolf, dirtyfox, benluv74, kneelsfordogs)


Other things to consider:

- Make sure the state allows people to own wolf hybrids - (dirty fox, kneelsfordogs)

- Research, research, research! - (dirtyfox, Itzwolf)

- Ask yourself; why do I want / need a wolf hybrid? - (silkythighs)

- Do concern yourself with the cross portion as it will affect the mentality and actions of the wolf-hybrid - (dirtyfox, damienlove, Itzwolf)

- You must commit for life! - (general consensus)


Fin

So, please send more detailed information (such as the cross affects = I'm curious), experiences, other questions, concerns, comments etc are also welcome to better improve this list and more!


Speaking of which... I've made a few questions myself after writing out the summary:

Silkythighs mentioned "Still if you’re getting a hybrid dog/wolf because it would be cool to have one. Then you 'd better be an expert with years of experience." My questions stemming from this comment is:

- What could be some other reasons / purposes for adopting a wolf hybrid?
Adding my own input to the question is - dog sledding, maybe hunting partner... But honestly, I can't really come up with a good answer to better convince myself of being worthy of adopting one since my affection for wolves is the main reason why...
And to add a defensive wall to my current mentality; it sounds like that's one reason why Itzwolf has adopted them, "I always loved howling with them...was such a cool experience," but I could be over-analyzing.

- Another question from the same quote is how can one define: "be an expert?"
I would like to believe that I've had enough practice / training to consider myself an expert since I've worked at two Animal Shelters for over 3 years. I've been through numerous training and skill classes with dogs of every shape and size. There even was one occasion when a wolf cross came to the shelter and I was higher than a kite in a hurricane (see picture). It was clear that he was much more intelligent than the other dogs and I had to be much quicker on my feet (so to speak) to keep the situation under control. Since the shelter had special limits put on the wolf hybrid (protective custody) I was unable to walk the wolf any farther than from his kennel to the exercise yard and thus unable to really get a feel for how he would act.

My last question addresses the problems of leaving hybrids alone:
- Would it be better to have more than just the wolf-hybrid at the household so as to encourage his pack instinct and hopefully discourage the destruction and escaping that Wirehair commented on?
I want to be clear... my asking this doesn't mean I would use this as a substitute by any means to me personally being with the pets. On the contrary, I want to spend every waking moment with them if I get the opportunity!


WOW this is a freaking long post and my batteries are going to start running out soon, sorry about that. Hope you enjoyed reading and please keep updating this stuff! I want to make sure that no rock is left unturned!

Thanks to all those the have and will post! Viva los lobos! :D

I apparently don't have access at the moment to my picture of the wolf-hybrid I was talking about. :crying:
I can tell you though that his name is Timber and was a 95% wolf and 5% husky or malamute (I think it's husky but I can't be sure). Therefore, I'll add some pictures sometime... probably in a couple days.

After decades of misinterpretation of wolves as being vicious animals, a new myth has formed – that a wolf is just a “big dog”. This is not true. Wild wolves are simply that – wild. Dogs have been domesticated for 20,000 to 50,000 years and have evolved into a completely different animal. They are well suited to living with humans, and with over a hundred different types of dogs to choose from, there is no reason for keeping a wild animal.
Keeping wolves as pets is usually done for vanity. As people don’t know how to keep a wild animal, the wolf ends up suffering greatly.

The Human Society of the United States currently counts over 200,000 wolf-dog hybrids in this country alone, are being kept as pets. Crossing a wolf with a Malamute, Husky or German Shepherd is the most common mix today. The theory is, mixing a wolf with a domesticated breed will some how dilute the 'wild side' of the wolf.

"Nothing could be further from the truth. In fact, hybrids can be more aggressive than pure wolves, a lethal blend of wild predator and domestic animal that has lost its fear of man. Hybrids have a strong hunting instinct and have been known to regard small children as suitable prey."

Just Goggle "Wolves as Pets", there is countless info if you don't believe us here! Not one thread states any positives about wolves or hybrids as pets~ :whistling:

Here is a list of laws State by State~ :)

http://www.api4animals.org/b4a2_exotic_animals_summary.php



This post has been edited by tazman99 on Jun 29 2007, 04:28 PM

I agree with you tazman... These dogs usually are bought for vanity. And their instincts are so strong that they can pose danger to people. I remember whenever I ran our dog would chase you down and bite you!! She could also jump a 5 foot fence from a sitting position. But she was so affectionate and had such a fear of people that she wouldn't come close to strangers. And people would look at her and stay away because of her reaction. I would always worry about what could have happend if she was cornered by a stranger, or threatened. The sad reality is people are breeding them and selling them to just anyone with enough cash. I hope the states will continue to make more laws concerning wolf hybrid breeding and ownership.

There is a highly interesting NOVA program which proposes a believable theory concerning the derivation of domestic dogs from wolf ancestors. Basically, it proposes dogs have evolved from wolf ancestors which "hung around" human garbage sites and utilized the human "leavings" as a significant foodsource. The qualities that produced this behavior were over time reinforced by inbreeding, which resulted in greater compatibility between wolf and human, thus eventually producing the dog, and later on the various breeds thereof. This would have been a relatively rapid evolutionary event, and as dogs and wolves seem to be genetically compatible, I often wonder if both should not be considered as variants of the same species !

It seems, as shylark initially mentioned, the overall amount of opinions and facts are stacking up against the idea of adopting a hybrid (especially the rules and regulations of each state). I had come to terms with this a while ago, but I guess the thread of hope was too strong to break. :pinch:

Even though those who own a hybrid have positive remarks, I suppose their skill level has reached a point where it would be hard to relate to the difficulty someone who hasn't fully dealt with a hybrid would have. In other words, what they think is easy may in fact be difficult for someone lacking in 'experience'. But then... how would someone acquire experience in the first place... maybe fostering? :thinking:

Still, it probably is best to adopt a malamute or husky.

Hmm, well I'm still not satisfied one way or another... both routes have major ups and downs. I suppose I'll just sweep it under the rug for now... but don't let that stop you all from adding more comments! Thanks again and here is a picture of Timber - the hybrid I worked with:

Attached Image ( Click on thumbnail to view full size image )

Looks like a beautiful animal, what I can see of it- it seems that my postings don't qualify either in quantity or quality (or both) for me to be allowed to download your posted photo. In consequence I have to "make do" with the thumbnail ! Anyway, whatever you decide, I certailny wish you success!

Despite everything labeling them as not a good pet I still put in my 2 cents. With the right owner they will flourish. My Fiancé’s father had a beautiful Bitch named Keena who was the apple of his eye. Dave has become lax in his care for his dog as of late (now a 7 year old epileptic biting asshole English bulldog) but to hear the family put it Keena hated every female that approached her mate (and I wouldn't have doubted he might have gone Zoo for her had it not been for my fiancé’s mom) and she'd only listen to him. Not even would she listen to his father. I forgot what happened to her but I believe she died of old age. This was roughly 20+ years ago.
If someone were as diligent as he was when he was younger, and following the guidelines set by those who have done it before, I wouldn't see where there would be a problem. It takes however a great understanding of wolf behavior and general biology for someone who just want them because they’re “oh too cool”. Definitely not for the beginner. And if someone must insist fine get in contact with a professional who can train them and you or better yet get some college preferably Zoology. Hell… There are schools out there that are specifically for zookeepers in the making. What better to do if one really insists to have a wolf or hybrid?
I had dreams of raising my own wolf pack when I read the book Julie of the wolves years back. They were the greatest animal second only to the Otter in my eyes. Now I see I would be eaten alive since I cannot seem to put the fear of dominance in two little minpins (mums dogs) lol!
It’s a matter of assessing A. what you can handle and B. what you’re willing to do to handle what you want

my 2 cents. all one can do is warn of the pros and cons, but we cannot make anyone do anything. ;)

Been there, done that. I have 1/2 wolf bitch. She needs most of my free time just to keep her from reverting. I have also raised two wolf pups, trained them and then returned them to the wild. A lot of hard work and very little fun but rewarding in seeing them doing the natural wolf thing.
The female often stops by to show me her latest litter.

Aww thats so sweet! You're one of the pack and at least you know she's doing well if she's coming back with litters I'm betting she managed Alpha. that goes to show you did a wonderfu job ^.^

Your reply doesn't belong in this conversation. Please stay on subject.

I am amazed at how absolutley intellegent everyone here is on this subject, I have not been around a group more knowledgable!!!! The other thing I want to bring up is breeders of hybrids. I have had the displeasure of meeting quite a few and they are a very unsavory lot. The worst was seeing 2-3 "dogs" kept in very small, 12x12, enclosures, always dirty, never bathed or brushed. Feed 'em & breed 'em. It was horrible. I was young then, 15 ish but I'll never forget how bad I felt for them. Just always watch out for someone who breeds for profit.

Puppy millers... you know I hat'em. these guys are the kind of people should be taken and shot. They will get their's in the end when they get taken in for animal cruelty. They just don't realize if you want something worth selling you have to make the environment worth it too!

Forgive me I'm having trouble with my comp and it ssent the message out before I finished.

I used to watch things like wild animal rescues and my mom would have to turn it off because I would get so outraged at the puppy mill stories. I was a very violent child when it came to animals and it showed in what I wanted to do to the people who were so cruel to these animals. people should not breed if all they care about is profit. breeding should be the main concern to make sure only the best tempered and healthiest animals. Seeing those adorable pup faces when they come to the world! and watching them grow until they are sold to loving families.
And I have rambled maybe I should have left it where it was a t before the edit? lol

This post has been edited by SukiedaSalukie on Jul 1 2007, 06:04 AM